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329 posts in this topic
2 hours ago, Paeng said:

... and great team-up  :hand17::D

 

Thank you @Paeng!

 

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xD xD xD xD

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Very nice buildings. "Reaper's shed" sounds a bit scary. I love the model though. Those green bales look great.

I'm not sure I want to eat a salad made from grass bales though. Bit too healthy for my liking. Wild cereals sounds interesting though.

 

 

Reaper.jpg

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Great work, love the team effort ;)

Not quite a 'lawn mower' (haha jk), but I really like the idea of the smaller footprinted 'Reaper'.  Being able to place it in an area where the grass naturally grows in the forests, and maintain it's minimal output is an excellent way of helping a forest stay balanced without too much micromanaging, *if* that's what has helped develop this idea.

I really like where the production chain is head to as well. :D

Quick questions:  
-- Will the thatch still be used as a source of fuel, or will you be leaving that to the 'reeds' to be bundled in the CC fire bundler?  Or, make it so both will produce some sort of fire brick, having their own merged production chain, in a way? A singular building that will take both Level 2 outputs, and creating the Fire*brick/bundle/lighter for those that harvest the grass & reeds but don't necessarily use them in all future buildings?
-- I am interested to see if any of the Wild Cereals will be produced further, and if they too will be able to be used with other buildings and chains, such as the animal pens, fodder (RK), and the stables (CC etc) all which are already in existence.  
I don't mind if they're not, but, I do ask as I see parallels with something which may be suitable long term. :)  I am happy for their own production chains :)

*throwing ideas carelessly around 

Back to now ...  looks great, and I do love the names :D

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Posted (edited)

15 hours ago, stiles said:

how far do you want to take this? a mixed field of gass and corn threshed could give hay or fodder as RED labeled it. and we could feed livestock. a new barn and we feed cows to get milk and fertilizer.

How far we can! ;)

But first of all this mod speaks of natural diversity, so an eye of respect will always be aimed at enriching and improving the natural appearance of the game.

6 hours ago, QueryEverything said:

I don't mind if they're not, but, I do ask as I see parallels with something which may be suitable long term

All the suggestions are well accepted! This is just the basic chain! When it's complete and perfectly functional, we will go to the next step: expand the chain! :D

Refining of fuel and processing of wild cereals will certainly be one of the first things ;)

11 hours ago, elemental said:

"Reaper's shed" sounds a bit scary.

The reaper is scary! Don't make him angry! xD

 

 

As always thank you all for your compliments! ^_^

Edited by despo20
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@Bartender @despo20You are great, all ideas are fantastic. I can not wait for the new mod edition. I am interested in these berry bushes, will there be any varieties?The buildings are fantastic Question whether this mod will work without CC I would like to put "The North"?Thank you @Bartender and @despo :DYou are 2 great.:shape13::hand16:

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Thanks everyone :)!

20 hours ago, stiles said:

interesting. i take it the yields will change some and the thatch is a bundle of grass ? no more burning plain grass. that is imporved. how far do you want to take this? a mixed field of gass and corn threshed could give hay or fodder as RED labeled it. and we could feed livestock. a new barn and we feed cows to get milk and fertilizer.

Yes, we will adapt the yields to create a healthy balance for the new chain. We have been thinking about a way to make this compatible with Red's fodder, but we haven't reached a conclusion yet.

19 hours ago, Paeng said:

* though some may find a team of Thresher and Reaper and Maggi Thatcher rather... umm... frightening?  :ph34r:

When I was doing research for the thatcher building, I once made the mistake of doing a google image search for 'Thatcher'. Didn't quite get the result I expected :P.

10 hours ago, QueryEverything said:

Quick questions:  

-- Will the thatch still be used as a source of fuel, or will you be leaving that to the 'reeds' to be bundled in the CC fire bundler?  Or, make it so both will produce some sort of fire brick, having their own merged production chain, in a way? A singular building that will take both Level 2 outputs, and creating the Fire*brick/bundle/lighter for those that harvest the grass & reeds but don't necessarily use them in all future buildings?
-- I am interested to see if any of the Wild Cereals will be produced further, and if they too will be able to be used with other buildings and chains, such as the animal pens, fodder (RK), and the stables (CC etc) all which are already in existence. 

The fuel seems to be a much appreciated option, so we'll definitely look into that ;). We'll also dive a bit deeper into all the possibilities of 'hooking on' to existing chains in other mods. We do have many ideas ourselves though, so we might also decide to do everything our own way :P.

39 minutes ago, taniu said:

@Bartender @despo20You are great, all ideas are fantastic. I can not wait for the new mod edition. I am interested in these berry bushes, will there be any varieties?The buildings are fantastic Question whether this mod will work without CC I would like to put "The North"?Thank you @Bartender and @despo :DYou are 2 great.:shape13::hand16:

I haven't worked on the bushes recently, but my original intentention was to add more variants indeed. They will come in time I guess ;). Just like the original version, v1.1 will be completely stand alone :). It won't require any other mods to use it. I'm not sure if it would be completely compatible with the North, we'll test that.

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@Bartender @despo20 I have a proposal and also a question? Is it possible to make a small pond where fishes, frogs, snakes, snails, etc. are used to fish? There are beautiful plants but no animals, a little empty is the world "Banished" off the deer and ducks in the forest. Can you add something to the mods? "Natural diversity Light - this mod works in" the North "or" Natural Diversity "?Frogs and turtles are only in CC and not every game with this mods. I very much like Mods CC but would like such a pond was generic to the landscape in "Banished" It is now mod "Marritimes Riffle" is a fancier thing. I proposed creating a pond by @ RedKetchup but it is very busy with new mods. "NMT v3 can do and add to" GardenWalls "but it can last up to half a year. I sent some photos to new insights? I think Sir @RedKetchup will not be angry that here on this site I write and ask for a small pond.

You are great and maybe, you will make mod small pond among flowers. Very please:D

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Hi @taniu!

We are now working on the aquatic part of the mod, so your request arrives at the right time :D

A pond is a fascinating idea, it could find a place in mod. I mark it in the list of things to do ;)

 

The relaxed frog is amazing! xD

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On 5/10/2017 at 0:43 AM, Bartender said:

Thanks everyone :)!

Yes, we will adapt the yields to create a healthy balance for the new chain. We have been thinking about a way to make this compatible with Red's fodder, but we haven't reached a conclusion yet.

When I was doing research for the thatcher building, I once made the mistake of doing a google image search for 'Thatcher'. Didn't quite get the result I expected :P.

The fuel seems to be a much appreciated option, so we'll definitely look into that ;). We'll also dive a bit deeper into all the possibilities of 'hooking on' to existing chains in other mods. We do have many ideas ourselves though, so we might also decide to do everything our own way :P.

I haven't worked on the bushes recently, but my original intentention was to add more variants indeed. They will come in time I guess ;). Just like the original version, v1.1 will be completely stand alone :). It won't require any other mods to use it. I'm not sure if it would be completely compatible with the North, we'll test that.

9

@Bartender & @despo20

"The fuel seems to be a much appreciated option, so we'll definitely look into that ;) . We'll also dive a bit deeper into all the possibilities of 'hooking on' to existing chains in other mods. We do have many ideas ourselves though, so we might also decide to do everything our own way :P ."

Absolutely, of course you must do it in your style, and no need to hook on to everything, I completely agree with you on that one.
My concern came from more a  ....  Reeds x 2, (++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++  <---  message from my cat who sat here whilst I was AFK); Fuel x 2 perspective, that we would end up with duplicate resources, but could only be used with X or Y buildings, that they couldn't be globally used. 
I'm happy for a dozen workshops, buildings etc, from dozens of themed mods, but duplicates of existing items can be frustrating if you then have to spend valuable building resources to build building X, when you really needed Y.  

As an example of Cows, and Eggs many mods add different textures, and different sprites to the mods version of the item, so which ever mod is on top, that resource texture shows ingame, and the sprite in the UI, but under the covers, the item is still the same and can be used in any building that will accept them. :)  

I also am excited by adding new resources that the mods bring, and if there is diversity (Reeds & Reeds: ABC) or, widening the berry ideas etc ... I am not in anyway suggesting conformity to the other mods, but the ability to utilise common files. :D  

I seem to have waddled around in a circle, and I assume you completely understand what I mean, and I know that you will bring awesomenss with the expansion of this mod, and I have no need to worry, and I'm not, just am hoping that you know I wasn't asking for 'conformity' either :):):)  
Ok, I'm done ...  LOLOL
 

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Posted (edited)

@taniu I think ponds would be an excellent addition to our planned decoration pack ;).

@QueryEverything Being a highschool teacher, I know from experience that it never hurts to explain something twice ;). Or thrice for some students. And frice(?).. fourice(?).. four times for the extremely forgetful ones.

To get to the content of your post, I completely agree. Duplication of similar items is something we will avoid at all costs; it's unnecessary and only leads to a frustrating gameplay experience. The 'hooking on' to chains created by other modders that I was referring to, is a bit of a different case. What I meant is that it's sometimes difficult to make something compatible with a chain that was designed from a different philosophy.

For example, it would make sense for us to make a link with Red's fodder in his Garden Walls mod, as fodder is produced from grasses. The problem however, is that his chain works completely different from ours; the grasses in GW produce fodder directly, where ours produce grass bales which first need to be processed. Now to make the mods compatible, we could make a building that produces fodder from grass bales. However, this building would be completely useless if the player doesn't have GW active as well. It would also create two very different ways of producing fodder, making for an unintuitive gameplay experience and a chain that is difficult to balance. Another option would be to make one of our resources, for example the grass bales, directly useable as fodder in GW. That would create problems with inconsistent names however, and the balance of our resource would have to be adapted to the pre-existing one. In a case like this, I personally don't see any adequate solution to make the chains work together in an acceptable way.

I guess I've been rambling a bit as well here, but I always feel that these kind of things also help us to make sense of our own thoughs ;)

Edited by Bartender
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49 minutes ago, Bartender said:

I personally don't see any adequate solution to make the chains work together in an acceptable way.

The mod kit is very limited by the fact that you can only control the output of production through the resource, not the building. This means it is very difficult to blend two mods with different production styles as you said, because balancing is all but impossible with this method. It is also very easy to break another chain, like I did with CC charcoal B| .

At the end of the day, my advise would be to stay true to your course and make your mod the way you want it to be. Modding is after all a personal thing and we all have our own ideas of what we want the game to be. If when all is said and done it fits well with another mod, by all means make the link, if not well, as long as it doesn't break any other chains, then it isn't a problem. Duplicate resources can easily be managed by being careful when naming things. There is always the option of making a cross over version of the mods, like Kidd made a Forest Outpost Nat Div edition. I was thinking of making some 'RedNec' mods (I trade mark the name because I think it is cool ;) ), versions of mine that fit perfectly with some of @Ketchup mods where the two could. An example would be a RedNec Crystal Cliffs that is a re-designed crystal cliffs chains using Red's fodder... I can't do it as is now because the chains are built differently, but it would work as a different version.

Some Natural Martimes Diversity versions of my mods might be in order in the future, we'll see what you come up with!

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you could do a building that processes grass to fodder as an add-on mod. you could also expand on RED's idea and make a dairy barn that produces milk and fertilizer from the grass.or even use sheep and give wool and fertilizer.the fertilizer then could be used at RED's greenhouses. RED did change his production numbers.it has been lowered a lot,more than i expected. finding a solution that hits somewhere between huis old and new outputs would not throw the balance off far.

  on another note. i was reading on some other older mods yesterday. my understanding is the game creates the map in layers. lays down the  stone,then iron, then the trees. i think it said there are 3 different layers. can it be forced to lay down 4 or 5? the 4th being your plants and the 5th being another set of trees or older trees? i got that by reading about the old growth forests mod.

https://banishedinfo.com/mods/view/286-Old-Growth-Forests i was trying to come up with a way to make spots of forests with thicker growth. not sure if it will be helpful.  you and NECORA's pine mod stop the other 1 from working.

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@stiles I actually really like that idea, having an old growth forest along with a newer one and meadows. 

It could be 1 - stone, 2 - iron, 3 - trees, 4 - nat div meadows, 5 - old growth stands. That might be a bit too much for a small map, I don't know.

The reason it would be cool though is that you could have new tree models for the old growth, including fewer big trees and also dead trees (typical of old growth forest). This is ideal habitat for a lot of animals, so you could concentrate trapping resources here as well as mushrooms. Then in the new growth forests you have more berries and things.

While I am at it, @Bartender could I see how you made the reeds only spawn by the river? I want to make the beaver lodge and fiddleheads only spawn on river/lake banks.

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Posted (edited)

On 13-5-2017 at 2:21 PM, Necora said:

The mod kit is very limited by the fact that you can only control the output of production through the resource, not the building. This means it is very difficult to blend two mods with different production styles as you said, because balancing is all but impossible with this method. It is also very easy to break another chain, like I did with CC charcoal B| .

At the end of the day, my advise would be to stay true to your course and make your mod the way you want it to be. Modding is after all a personal thing and we all have our own ideas of what we want the game to be. If when all is said and done it fits well with another mod, by all means make the link, if not well, as long as it doesn't break any other chains, then it isn't a problem. Duplicate resources can easily be managed by being careful when naming things. There is always the option of making a cross over version of the mods, like Kidd made a Forest Outpost Nat Div edition. I was thinking of making some 'RedNec' mods (I trade mark the name because I think it is cool ;) ), versions of mine that fit perfectly with some of @Ketchup mods where the two could. An example would be a RedNec Crystal Cliffs that is a re-designed crystal cliffs chains using Red's fodder... I can't do it as is now because the chains are built differently, but it would work as a different version.

Some Natural Martimes Diversity versions of my mods might be in order in the future, we'll see what you come up with!

I completely agree with this. In the end we're all trying to shape the game in our own way, and we shouldn't be scared of doing so if we're shaping it into something else than another modder did.

I agree that cross-over versions and mod collections are perhaps the best way to overcome these differences, as the original mod can stay 'pure' in that way.

On 13-5-2017 at 6:10 PM, stiles said:

you could do a building that processes grass to fodder as an add-on mod. you could also expand on RED's idea and make a dairy barn that produces milk and fertilizer from the grass.or even use sheep and give wool and fertilizer.the fertilizer then could be used at RED's greenhouses. RED did change his production numbers.it has been lowered a lot,more than i expected. finding a solution that hits somewhere between huis old and new outputs would not throw the balance off far.

  on another note. i was reading on some other older mods yesterday. my understanding is the game creates the map in layers. lays down the  stone,then iron, then the trees. i think it said there are 3 different layers. can it be forced to lay down 4 or 5? the 4th being your plants and the 5th being another set of trees or older trees? i got that by reading about the old growth forests mod.

https://banishedinfo.com/mods/view/286-Old-Growth-Forests i was trying to come up with a way to make spots of forests with thicker growth. not sure if it will be helpful.  you and NECORA's pine mod stop the other 1 from working.

For the moment I personally don't really feel like there would be much to gain from redoing Red's work, so if anything it would be something like an add-on or a cross-over version indeed ;).

The idea of an old growth forest is definitely an interesting one, it adds realism and even more diversity to the environment. I have thought about it before, since OwlChemist is no longer actively modding we can't expect him to update his mods to work with everything that's coming out now, but there's some good ideas and it would be a shame to lose them. For the moment I didn't try my luck on trees yet, but it's something I definitely want to do at some point.

On 13-5-2017 at 6:16 PM, Necora said:

While I am at it, @Bartender could I see how you made the reeds only spawn by the river? I want to make the beaver lodge and fiddleheads only spawn on river/lake banks.

Making things spawn lower is done simply by changing the range with the minHeight and maxHeight, but there's a catch.. It only works for resources that are spawned through the StartConditions.rsc, and only for their initial spawning behaviour. The problem is that for reseeding or for secondary spawning (through another resource) the game seems to completely ignore the min and maxheight settings; it just places them between 0.0 and 1.0 by default. This is really a big flaw in the coding if you ask me. For the reeds, we had to turn off reseeding and make them everliving. We also had lots of problems finding a way to make a reed farm in a realistic way, though we did find something in the end.

Another issue that you have to take into account is that all tiles below 0.0 are marked as 'water' or 'deepwater'. If you set the minheight too low, the resource may be spawned in places that are unreachable for the bannies. For the reeds, I set minHeight to -0.7 and maxHeight to -0.1, which seems to be fine.

Edited by Bartender
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On 5/13/2017 at 9:23 PM, Bartender said:

 

@QueryEverything Being a highschool teacher, I know from experience that it never hurts to explain something twice ;). Or thrice for some students. And frice(?).. fourice(?).. four times for the extremely forgetful ones.

11

I can certainly see the highschool teacher, and poet, in your post today @Bartender:)
Both you & @despo20 have done an amazing amount of work, and Despo, I must say, I love those ground rocks!  They're pretty awesome.  

So much can be gained in this game with even just the smallest of details, thank you for your update!! :)

Quote

 It was a week of bushes, boats, bridges, brainstorms about biofuels, and branches. There were other things, such as rocks, reeds and raw materials, but their names did not fit well into the last sentence. 

 

Love that ...  almost could've made it a little poem :)

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Thanks @QueryEverything!

My friend @Bartender is a poet indeed! I love his Sneak Peeks! They make it look like what we do even more beautiful :D

 

15 hours ago, Bartender said:

kill two birds with one stone (or two flies in one slap as we say in Dutch)

In Italy we say: take two pigeons with a bean xD

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Haha, thank you :)! I wouldn't concider myself much of a poet, especially not in english, but I do enjoy writing a lot. One day I'll be good enough to publish some things :P.

46 minutes ago, despo20 said:

In Italy we say: take two pigeons with a bean xD

I like that one, at least no animals are harmed that way :D!

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I hope so too, but probably the purpose is to catch them to eat them :ph34r: xD

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