Maritimes Development Thread

[KevinTheCynic]

<a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/8298-stiles/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="8298" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/8298-stiles/">@stiles</a> I'm sure everyone here knows it's really frustrating to play a game for hours and then one little thing happens and corrupts the save or causes CTD (or Banished's favourite Fatal Access Violation) so when testing a new mod I try to use as many different approaches for a test as I can think of. This includes deliberately doing the wrong things to try and force the mod to crash. It's a brute force approach but it sometimes reveals problems really quickly that otherwise stay hidden for many turns of normal gameplay. The information about what I did to force a crash can be important to a mod maker sometimes because it reveals a problem they didn't get when they tested the mod (because they installed and ran the mod the correct way)... and there will always be players who don't follow the instructions (or won't read the Read-Me notes) for correctly installing a mod.




I've actually been able to add a lot of Banished mods to a saved game and had the save playable for many game years. Updates to mods in use tend to be the biggest cause of problems if adding them to a saved game. When a saved game becomes too unstable I delete it and start again trying a different method.




 




<a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/5518-necora/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="5518" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/5518-necora/">@Necora</a> From what I see over at the WoB site in regards to the Plimoth Plantation mod, it suffers the same problem with coal & steel tools. The mod author said basically that the <abbr title="Colonial Charter">CC</abbr> mod changes flags & functions from the vanilla game and he infers that his mod was made in line with the vanilla flags & functions. He appeared confident that the inclusion of his mod into the MegaMod would address the problem (I'm assuming because authors supply their string tables to allow their mods to be incorporated into MegaMod) - however... I don't use MegaMod so that's a non-starter for me but what it does imply is that the coal problem is a compatibility issue with <abbr title="Colonial Charter">CC</abbr>'s changed fuels & materials.

[KevinTheCynic]

Oh and <a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/5518-necora/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="5518" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/5518-necora/">@Necora</a> you have nothing to apologize for, you've managed to pump out several updates of your mod in the course of just a few weeks (or has it been less time than that?) It's a hell of a lot of work for one person to create, texture, code, check and test every aspect of a large mod so we players are in effect, your beta testers! [img]<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/biggrin.png[/img]/emoticons/biggrin@2x.png 2x" title=":D" width="20" />



With the level of quality of Banished mods, I reckon we players get rewarded well enough for our little bit of testing & feedback.

[stiles]

excellant work KEVIN. i haven't tried making steel tools with the plymouth mod yet aka "plantation" mod. does it matter if above or below <abbr title="Colonial Charter">CC</abbr> for that 1?? as i stated,i leave some of the tool makers set to lower grade tools on purpose. that is a gppd workaround but no new players might not think of that. it is always good to keep those modders informed for sure. one of the reasons it was good to see NECORA opt for a break. he was designing and building ahead,lol. glad he has more ideas,but sure his head is spinning by now. you think its time to tell him what he started doing and what he has done went different directions yet?? or should we let him run away with ideas farther?? lol

[Necora]

<a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/8298-stiles/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="8298" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/8298-stiles/">@stiles</a> haha the Port Royal was a little side track, but I assure you the rest is on course [img]<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/wink.png[/img]/emoticons/wink@2x.png 2x" title=";)" width="20" /> the idea was always a fishing based mod, but also to fill in some gaps that I believe existed in the colonial theme of the game. While others (<abbr title="Colonial Charter">CC</abbr>, DS, Ketchup, Kidd...) have gone down a more medieval route, I really wanted more colonial and new world buildings. Around Nova Scotia, fisheries and ship building were a major factor of colonial life, the same with New England. But I always wanted to add more churches, schools etc. to the game because I am a sucker for variation. While the <abbr title="Colonial Charter">CC</abbr> buildings, esp. the new ones, are without a doubt outstanding, I want more of a colonial flavour, so decided to try it myself! So it seemed natural to have fishing/ship building as the basis of the mod. On the other hand, things did snowball and I ended up having to add a lot more production chains to support this industry, especially to keep it as a stand alone mod. I also have some ideas for more chains, such a building that turns wood into pitch and charcoal etc.




<a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/314-kevinthecynic/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="314" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/314-kevinthecynic/">@KevinTheCynic</a> I really appreciate the feed back and issues. One of the problems with testing is that I can't spend too much time doing  it, especially as some of these additions are later in the game. I can and do use the de-bug menu to test what I can think of, but it is not the same as playing it through.




 




So it seems the issue with <abbr title="Colonial Charter">CC</abbr> is a storage flag issue. I'll dig into it a little deeper.

[Necora]

OK both issues have now been fixed.




 




https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2nh4i...jJkczhkUmM

[Denis de la Rive]

Look at the storage charts in the wiki to see the flags used in <abbr title="Colonial Charter">CC</abbr>, (in the header), there are differences. Coal is a fuel I think. If you are looking for a very large and partly nautical nautical chain, I have researched turpentine, have hand written notes, warning it very complex. You would need several building and products.  [img]<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/5846347f69072_EmojisApplebyKawaiiDarkToxic495.png[/img] 

[Necora]

<a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/20-denis-de-la-rive/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="20" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/20-denis-de-la-rive/">@Denis de la Rive</a> thanks. I got confused between the names of the storage flags under the hood - what is coal and what is coalfuel. As for nautical chains, I'd like to see your notes if you don't mind sharing them. I was thinking of turpentine too think that pine pitch might be easier to start with, you only need one building for it and it can be used in a range of items for future additions. Turpentine you need to distill, pine pitch is made from burning roots and branches of pine trees (wood in game) in an anoxic environment, and it produced charcoal and pine pitch. So you only need one building with the input of wood to produce a fuel and a material. Pitch can then be used with hemp for corking and a more advanced version of rope, and various other things.

[Denis de la Rive]

I looked at pin tar, also, there is a nifty visual that you could use, in RL its dismantled after each use, but you could make it a building in Banished. I have visuals for turpentine making stills too. 




So you start with logs for pin tar and make pitch and products you indicated, but you can also combine it with turpentine to make nautical supplies, and health chests for naval use, (tonic, camphor, purgatives, and such). I dont think you need to make each component, just the final product.




What is interesting is you can make turpentine, or the solid form rosin without logs. You have trees drop tree sap, (which can have other uses, like maple products, paint or dyes), that is collected like with wild foods. You could use logs, but historically pines were milked like maple without cutting the trees, and all that involves. It can also represent beech sap.




Uses of turpentine, or rosin, (same production method, just a solid), its a paint thinner, and solvent as such very useful in naval circules. Paint, varnish, wax, camphor, tonics, flavour for gin, and as lamp oil. In the 17 to early 20th century it was crucial to any navy, it is generally obscured by the term naval supplies that included many things derived from it. You could even push the production details to have chains using beeswax, herbs, alcohol, and a second dose of tree sap. If you wanted to you could make perfumes, and red pain with vermillion, (an important part of the fur trade, but you need a mine).




Building on this you get tree sap, (beech oil) to make "Russian" leather, by a process resembling tanning. Its waterproof, so again many naval uses, it also is used to make high end furniture, or boots. I could see it being used in many products used on ships. 




So you see it can get very complicated, if you want it to. In you mod I think nautical supplies, and medicine chest would fit with the nautical theme. 




Here are the images I found, from some of them you get an idea of how important this forgotten industry was.




https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BzHkvl...Gh2SU12X1k




https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BzHkvl...ldMWDRHS1k




Happy to help with research or design, sorry not good with coding.

[stiles]

NECORA, we are not complaining at all. we like variety as well. the fort was a nice addition. as to the colonial style,i hope pilgrim keeps woking on his ideas. that was to be  a huge mod set. i changed my game by adding THE NORTH to it. i have no "fish". i have salmon and trout,no "fish".not a big deal. i can't dry or smoke or salt no fish as far as i know.

[KevinTheCynic]

<a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/8298-stiles/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="8298" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/8298-stiles/">@stiles</a> It doesn't seem to matter where the Plimoth Plantation mod is placed, it will not make any Steel Tools if it is used with <abbr title="Colonial Charter">CC</abbr>. I placed it above and below <abbr title="Colonial Charter">CC</abbr> and the result was the same. I mentioned to <a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/5518-necora/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="5518" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/5518-necora/">@Necora</a> that the mod author (Kid1293) had said over at WoB that the Plantation mod uses vanilla flags for coal but <abbr title="Colonial Charter">CC</abbr> changes those flags. Because of this, it won't be compatible with <abbr title="Colonial Charter">CC</abbr> no matter where you locate Plimoth Plantation in your mod list.




The only way to get the Plantation mod to make Steel Tools is to use the mod without <abbr title="Colonial Charter">CC</abbr> [img]<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/sad.png[/img]/emoticons/sad@2x.png 2x" title=":(" width="20" /> I don't want to do that so I'll put up with the lack of Steel Tools from the Plantation Supplies building and just use another blacksmith to make them.