<a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/5518-necora/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="5518" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/5518-necora/">@ Necora</a> This comment is more me thinking out loud than presenting any solid concepts because I don't know how much difficulty would be involved with it so yeah, take it for what it's worth!
I do understand that this idea is going to be a lot more work but I wonder if a little "artistic licence" could be invoked? I think the mill model you've made is fantastic and it's a real shame that you can't get the two levels of water but perhaps a mill (not necessarily this specific mill) could be made so that the waterwheel empties into the stream/river but it's mill pond is on the land (like Red Ketchup's village pond from the <abbr title="New Medieval Town">NMT</abbr> mod)? The mill pond would be fed by a spring (meaning that there would be something else that needed to be modelled) so you don't have to worry about having a stream lead to the pond. Or perhaps even a fake water channel could be lead off from the stream to feed the mill pond?
There's already a couple of canal type mods for the game that try to replicate water channels although I don't know if they'd be much use for this particular idea. I am going to be presumptuous and assume it would be much easier to create a dam that way rather than try to replicate one on the Banished waterways but I can see that it would still be a little finicky in terms of placement. Although if it was modular it may make placement a little easier perhaps?
The other idea is also troublesome and would involve trying to trick the Player's eye into thinking that water level is higher on the waterwheels upstream area. I have no clear idea how to achieve this or even if it can be achieved with Banished, but I was thinking if the dam wall is aligned with the stream rather than cutting across it, (so more of a channel rather than just a straight dam wall), perhaps the walls could be angled slightly so that it appears to be all the same heightbut is in fact lower at one end - the lower end would be near the waterwheel to give the impression of the water having collected behind the dam wall (that appears to be all the same height).
As mentioned, I don't know if it's actually able to be modelled in Banished but perhaps someone with a better grasp of modding than me can see a way to achieve it? Or at the very least it may provide some inspiration! [img]<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/biggrin.png[/img]/emoticons/biggrin@2x.png 2x" title=":D" width="20" />
<a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/314-kevinthecynic/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="314" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/314-kevinthecynic/">@ KevinTheCynic</a> Hmmm. Yeah, I was thinking of a mill pond on the land behind the mill, it would be fed into by a stream of some sort. It would also be fun to have a modular pond or something that can be built anywhere, like the current canals but at 0 height rather than sunk. More of a visual thing than a functional thing.
One of the problems of a modular dam system in the river is you are asking a lot of the player to create such a thing. While some are great at the visual stuff and willing to put the time in, others perhaps don't want to spend a lot of time making one mill. Also, the terraforming tools in Banished are so rough, once you have changed it you can't get it back to how it was. Perhaps it will be something I work on an see if I can get something that works, but for the time being I think this does the job quite well. It would be neat to find a texture that mimics the water texture, the only problem is I don't think you can code such a transparent texture in game (see discussions on greenhouses elsewhere on the forum). I prefer the first option, making a whole land based stream system that fills into the rivers. That might be a good project for <a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/4-shockpuppet/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="4" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/4-shockpuppet/">@ ShockPuppet</a> once he is done with 1.7!
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1 minute ago, Necora said:
That might be a good project for <a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/4-shockpuppet/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="4" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/4-shockpuppet/">@ShockPuppet</a> once he is done with 1.7!
But shockpuppet and co. are doing many mods already and also making a new game in Unreal Engine [img]<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/smile.png[/img]/emoticons/smile@2x.png 2x" title=":)" width="20" />
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2 minutes ago, Necora said:
texture that mimics the water texture
Well the actual texture in Banished for water is green [img]<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/smile.png[/img]/emoticons/smile@2x.png 2x" title=":)" width="20" /> bright fluorescent green. It is for mapping the ripples, theres a water shader that handles the visual side of things.
01-25-2017, 06:30 PM
(This post was last modified: 01-25-2017, 06:33 PM by Necora.)
I've been working on a few things lately, for the next update I want to include the full pine and early industry set. This has involved a whole range of new buildings, some still to be made. In the mean time, a little teaser of something I've just managed to get to work. The following two shots show a new forester and two new gatherer buildings. The forester plants only apple and maple trees. The apple trees drop apples, and the maple trees drop maple sap in nice convenient buckets. They also spawn hemp and flax for now. One gatherer building picks up the apples and maple sap, the other picks up the hemp and flax.
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This is great as it allows access to certain production chains earlier, and gives a good Maritimes flavor to the wild resources in maple and apples. Ultimately, I have the following three chains planned which will add more Maritimes flavors...
Pine Forester -> Plants Pines -> Spawns Pine Resin, Pine Boughs, Flax -> Picked up by the Pine Harvester
Maple Forester -> Plants Maple and Apple -> Spawns Maple Sap, Apples, Blueberries, Cranberries -> Picked up by Maritimes Forager
Vanilla Forester -> Plants Vanilla Trees -> Spawn Vanilla Wild Foods and Herbs -> Picked up by Gatherer (a new building for each of these to fit the set).
The new wild resources should not appear on the map outside of the radius of the designated forester hut. This means that you can style each forestry area to produce a certain range of goods for certain resources, and these resources are not available until you grow the right trees. There may be one more chain added, I've built the models for it but not decided how I want it to work yet.
The current test chain works great, the only problem is that the apple harvest is way too high - 1500 a year! Maybe this is why they made so much cider????
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can these be made in squares instead of circles? might be easier to place together if they are squares. do the trees still produce logs and firewood? that would drop your production #'s.how much of an affect does overlapping make? say you add a normal gatherer,hunter,herbalist,etc to the same area? i do think options like thiese might be the way to go. have rran ideas thru my own head trying to figure the best way.over at WOB,someone has bees and honey,and there was talk of wanting bird eggs.the problem i see is the more we add the less we get in production.how far away from a building can a worker work space be set?? does it have to be right up aaginst it?? i think your way with different foresters for different items would work but i wonder if it should be set up as a building more so you as amodder have control over the production numbers. especially if you plan to do many more wild items.think i counted over 10 noow. a variable of 1/10 per each square. and if we add more then it's less likely of a gatherer finding "x" item. not that you are wrong,cause i agree with your idea of grouping some items together. like the maple and apples.birds and bees,etc.
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21 minutes ago, stiles said:
can these be made in squares instead of circles? might be easier to place together if they are squares.
Well, these function as normal forester/gatherer buildings, only with specific resources. In that sense, I don't think you can have a square radius.
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22 minutes ago, stiles said:
do the trees still produce logs and firewood?
Yup, trees are still harvested for logs just as a normal forester, however of course you can turn this off if you just want to grow them for the spawned resources. I'm not sure it would lower production numbers too much, unless you are heavily harvesting for wood, but it is no different to the regular forester/gatherer combination.
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24 minutes ago, stiles said:
how much of an affect does overlapping make?
Well, there it is a bit different. In this instance, you really don't want to overlap at all. If you overlap different foresters, they will spitefully cut each others trees down to grow their own. If, say, you overlap a vanilla gatherer with a pine forester, the vanilla gatherer won't produce much at all because the vanilla wild items will not spawn in the pine forester area, only the pine wild items. Same if you placed a maple forager in the vicinity or a vanilla forester, there would be no maple sap to gather.
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26 minutes ago, stiles said:
how far away from a building can a worker work space be set?? does it have to be right up aaginst it??
I'm not sure what you mean. If you make a traditional resource building be it a crop field, orchard, quarry, blacksmith etc., the work is done in that building, not elsewhere. I don't think you can have a building on one lot then the harvesting on another lot, whether it is adjacent to it or not. That would be a question best asked for one of the BL crew. As far as I can tell, the only thing you can do to have the worker work outside of the building is to have the harvesting some sort of natural resource within a radius.
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28 minutes ago, stiles said:
i see is the more we add the less we get in production
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29 minutes ago, stiles said:
think i counted over 10 noow. a variable of 1/10 per each square. and if we add more then it's less likely of a gatherer finding "x" item
Well, there are a lot of available squares! And the way of splitting them up into different forestry/gatherer combinations means that you still only have 4 items available in that area. So you still have a 1/4 chance for each square, rather than 1/10, as it is all split up. That is one way I can see of balancing it so that each gatherer is not a) overpowered or b) struggling to produce enough of any one resource to make it worth while. Considering the amount of available squares in a 20 square radius, I think that the main limit on gathering rates is going to be time. When testing there were buckets of maple sap sitting for a fair while as the gatherer was eating, resting, going to church, getting firewood, etc.
Also, I am not sure about the idea of having large squares of lots, I'd have to add each tree individually or make it into some sort of advanced orchard, and I'm not sure you can add more than one output to an orchard, but I may be wrong on that just no one has done it that I know of. I'm also not sure how you would go about getting the tree animation to work in a large square, I can't remember now if the decorative trees move in the wind or not. If they do not, one here and there will not be noticeable, but a vast acreage of stationary trees might look odd.
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33 minutes ago, stiles said:
someone has bees and honey,and there was talk of wanting bird eggs.
Honey IMO is best in an apiary, but that is just my preference! Esp. as you can have more outputs like DS added to his small village, honey, combs, health things etc. Bird eggs would be cool to add.
NECORA,i agree we seem to be limited by the game. finding a good workaround is a challenge.with only 4 items per forester,how are the numbers if you make them the size of the mini mod? the biggest problem with circles is how they fit together. lately i've been placing the emporium in the center with a school,woodcutter, sometimes a medic clinic,etc. the emporium keeps the items flowing out from the various circles. takes up a lot of space. would not work well on a smaller or a mountain map.
you seem to have more ideas to add to the forest and other modders do as well.hence why i try to find a workaround to give the modder more control and to keep a good gatherer balance. KIDD came up with a good way with trying to add a vegetable garden. created a new seed and the end result is instead of 1 crop, you get a random mixture of crops off 1 field. it does take an extra worker to sort the vegetables. you could do "wild fruits" and then 1 worker brings in all the various items and then have sorters who take the "wild fruits" and sort them into the items you want. each sorter would give different items out. it is an extra step but might help maintain the balance and still give the modder more control. 1 could take the "wild fruits' and give you maple sap,1 would give you pine pitch,1 could give various fruits-apples,berries. or i suppose you could skip this step and just have the press take "wild fruits" and give cider out. the term wild fruits just implies anything found in the forest,although i think there must be a better term. the production numbers might look crazy unless you think of the fruits as number of trees. you might have a low input and a much larger output. if you set the wild fruits to in-edible until processed,the banis wont try eating your pines.
I like the idea of using inedible flags, although not sure how to do it. Perhaps you put the food under a different resource limit i.e. making the maple sap a textile rather than a food. But that would give more control.
About the one resource option, that is definitely an idea. I like the idea behind the garden mod that Kid made, although tbh I would have done it slightly different and instead of a sorting stall I would have made it into a mini garden lot that does the same thing, the bannie gets a 'seed vegetable' which is grown in a large crop field, that gets "planted" in the mini garden (a 2x2 tile lot or something) and produces a small range of various vegetables. Then you can have a functioning back yard garden, and can also apply it to a greenhouse. Or instead of having the seed vegetable grown in a crop field, a generic seed can be grown in a larger greenhouse or other building that is then used in the mini gardens and green houses. I think this might be a nice idea actually, it kinda mixes the garden mod of Kid and also the old Greenhouse that I believe <a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/3183-ketchup/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="3183" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/3183-ketchup/">@ Ketchup</a> made, if I am not mistaken. You grew seeds to plant for the trees etc. as decorations.
So in this case instead of 1 gatherer and forester per resource chain, we have just one of each building that harvests a generic item 'Wild Roots', 'Wild Fruits', 'Wild Saps', 'Wild Materials', 'Wild Goods', which then get processed into their subsequent parts, so wild fruits become blueberries, cranberries, apples etc.?
It is an interesting idea, although we already have 4 types producing 4 items, and I can think of a couple more if we want to add a fur trapper to this type of chain. That will either border on too powerful, or it will reduce the amount of each resource you ultimately end up with because it is split into so many things. You would definitely need to balance the output, so that 10 wild items = 10 random combination of foods. Another slight issue is that if all of these things are being harvested, you really need all of them to be used otherwise they just get feathered (my term for a useless item that takes up all of your resource limit or storage space) (p.s. when I call feathers useless it is just because I personally never set up anything to use them, nothing wrong with them at all!). So you are expecting that the player has the whole thing set up rather than just one of a certain one.
I do like the original way because you can choose what you gather, unless I do introduce a small gatherer for each type of resource, and they just collect all of that one type. It would have to sit on a very small square to take up less space... maybe a 1x1 or 1x2 with a road.
Hmm, interesting. I am at a bind now. I can't decide between one or the other. Anyone else have any ideas on this? <a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/4-shockpuppet/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="4" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/4-shockpuppet/">@ ShockPuppet</a> or <a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/3-kralyerg/&do=hovercard" data-mentionid="3" href="<___base_url___>/index.php?/profile/3-kralyerg/">@ Kralyerg</a> what do you think about this sort of thing and balancing it well? Specific gatherers like what I made or more generic things like Stiles suggest? I can't decide.
if i understand our idea to the garden ,u still need an extra worker to make it function.my concern would be will the game allow you to code such a thing? another idea but the game has limited us from. i would like to see the garden seed expanded to inclide some fruits and corn.
the reason for setting the gathered "wild items" to in-edible was to prevent the banis from eating the pines. it forces the player to need 2 workers early in game. gathered "wild items" are not yet fruit,sap,furs,etc. they just is. they become something when sorted or processed. hence say u harvest 10 wild items,those 10 can be anything. if all u have built is a sap boiler,he will harvest all 10 into sap. if u have a sap+cider press. the sap guy takes some and makes syrup and the press takes some and makes cider.or the pine guy takes some and makes turpentine,etc. what those wild items become is not controled by the forest but by the process that uses them. this is why i said the production numbers could b crazy. u have x amount of spaces and therefore x amount of items.if a sap guy is all u have how much syrup would u have? as oppsed to a cider mill only or a fruit sorter only??? and yet u want fair numbers if u had all the buildings operational. then i think u would want and be expected to have more gatherers runnin the forest to get those"wild items". the other thing is yes the gatherer has a max limit as to how many items he can find,but the processing doesn't. say the gatherer finds 100 items. u could have different produced items from that and still give fair yields. just set the sap to 1 wild item= whatever amount of syrup u think a forest should give. same as apples:1 "item" but u could get x amount of cider. the input and output would be controlled at the sorter<cider press,sap boiler,fur tannery,fruit sorter,etc.the work time would affect the output production as well. hope that heelps clarify how the thing could function.
gives the modder lots more control. the other thing by setting the gatherer to "wild items" is u dont have to redo the entire mod to expand it. you are just adding to the mod. would save u lots of work.and us reloading versions too.
To make a food inedible, just leave out the 'Edible' part in the template .rsc
So instead of: 'Edible | Protein' - you can have just Protein, it will be stored as a food, but will not be edible by citizens.
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